tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post4837414121002177059..comments2024-03-02T16:36:54.324-05:00Comments on Duck Comics Revue: Tuscan History WeekGeoX, one of the GeoX boys.http://www.blogger.com/profile/14658452994152399308noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post-17871906435249922762016-02-24T15:20:17.701-05:002016-02-24T15:20:17.701-05:00there's an extent to which the story transcend...<i>there's an extent to which the story transcends our notions of "good" and "bad"</i><br /><br />Meaning "so bad, it's good"? Irresistibly intriguing despite unenjoyable? Well, you got me curious...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post-38809656960956631182014-02-02T01:14:55.114-05:002014-02-02T01:14:55.114-05:00Hey, don't worry about it. We all have our up...Hey, don't worry about it. We all have our ups and downs. I hope everything's worked out for you. I'm glad to see you've resurfaced. I'm not sure it's so much that I "disliked" the script as that I was completely BAFFLED by it. It's undeniable that I've had my differences with Mr. Martina, but if you look at some of my later writing on his work, including my more recent translations, you'll see that I also have some positive things to say about him.<br /><br />Anyway, I look forward to whatever commentary you want to post. It's always insightful.GeoX, one of the GeoX boys.https://www.blogger.com/profile/14658452994152399308noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post-31883781033668073782014-02-01T22:28:30.899-05:002014-02-01T22:28:30.899-05:00I don't complain that you've been playing ...I don't complain that you've been playing with the wording a bit and even inserted some modern pop-cultural references. It's often a lot better than trying to stick to the literal words, and especially so with this story. First, it's in the alogical, creative, leaps-and-bounds, almost stream-of-consciousness Italian Disney style and spirit to begin with, and b.), the whole story is made up by a modern Donald and Scrooge, after all, so anything is possible when it comes to modern references.<br /><br />And believe me, you'd get even more mangling than with Hegel if you'd try to Google Translate my favorite philosopher, Theodor W. Adorno! ;)TlatoSMDnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post-3404449336507652992014-02-01T22:27:58.762-05:002014-02-01T22:27:58.762-05:00And there's yet another, now major difference ...And there's yet another, now major difference between American and Italian Disney narratives which I think has caused a grave misunderstanding here. Italian Duck stories never were too strong on the logic part or necessarily consistent about historical facts. They're more like fairy tales, or, as you've correctly assumed in your last review, like dreams taking a few known characters and events, totally mixing them up at random and throwing them upon our well-known Duckburg and Mouseton residents. Prior to the 1990s "Once upon a time in America" series, "Messere Ducato" was even something like a highpoint on more-or-less accurate, but creatively jigsawed historical references when it comes to Italian Disney comics (they even used the correct names of famous people! which is rare enough), and combined with the epic narrative and the amazing Carpi visuals, many, many German Duck fans also love this series, considering it the Italian Disney equivalent to Medieval and Renaissance literature.<br /><br />After all, what matters with the Italian spirit of doing Disney comics is not logic. The strong points of the Italians are, first and foremost, slapstick, and then, as you've correctly began sensing over the course of your reviews for "Messere Ducato", the better artists know how to create an immensely immersive sense of mood and atmosphere by mere visuals that at their very best (particularly with Carpi and Cavazzano) may even, especially due to panel and page compositions, evoke a sense of poetry and poetic beauty.<br /><br />In short, if you're liking the Italians even into your adult years, you're not in it for the logic, you're in it for the trip, for the quick emotional pay-off and funny relief, the lush, immersive visuals, in a typical mindset which can have a pretty short attention span and go on seemingly needless errants just as long as they look funny or pretty or whimsical. Call it an infantile or a psychedelic mind, it's what the Italians do so well and it's what separates their Disney comics so much from American Disney comics and those from elsewhere in Europe.<br /><br />All this, taken to the extreme for half a century, has resulted in vastly different narrative conventions in our cozy little boot of a country isolated all around by high Alps and the Mediterrean Sea, than with American and even Northern-European Disney comics, almost as radically different as Asian mangas are from Western comics (but you and me are immensely lucky that at least Italians share our Western script direction from left to right, which is fundamental for image composition!).<br /><br />And it doesn't end with characterization there. Italian Duck stories are like the complete antithesis to Rosa's hyperrealistic stories constructed with stoic logic, accurate physical science, and accurate historical facts. If you only compare Rosa to Barks, Barks may be more "fairy-tailish", but even Barks is utterly logic and coherent compared to the Italians. Over the decades, thousands of colorful supporting characters have come from Italy, some to come and go within a few panels, some to have stuck around for years, and sometimes they suddenly pop up again without any notice or much of an explanation after a short stint decades ago (though usually with Donald and/or the nephews shortly relating the events from the prior story). It's things like these, this wholly different philosophy and approach, why many little details in the "Messere Ducato" series will look as weird to you as mangas do to me, but I'll try to explain for each chapter separately.TlatoSMDnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post-9781936179223583432014-02-01T22:26:23.711-05:002014-02-01T22:26:23.711-05:00I'm so, so terribly sorry Geox! To make a long...I'm so, so terribly sorry Geox! To make a long story short, by the time I disappeared from your sight I had been procrastinating about a tiny change you'd demanded in chapter I for two or three weeks, when I was suddenly getting evicted from my place on short notice, which eventually ended up with all my stuff being dispersed over lotsa places, including my computer and all my hard drives, and with me tied up in lotsa legalese red tape to find a new place and get settled in.<br /><br />And by the time the dust settled after a few months and I'd gotten access to my stuff back, I was feeling so ashamed for having let you down on this that it's taken me until this very night to even just have another look at your invaluable blog (all this time fearing I'd find you being mighty pissed off at me, and reading your reviews of each chapter before I read your introduction here, it felt at first like you were panning the story exactly because of that) because I've been googling for Carpi scans to show them to somebody who's never heard of him.<br /><br />Now, having read your reviews of the individual chapters in the story, I see you mightily dislike the script by Martina, and you or somebody else has speculated the reason for its high INDUCKS rating would only be because of many Italian members and because of the story being about how great Italy is and so on.<br /><br />Don't you remember I told you even before we started our project that I've always cared more for the visual aspect of Disney stories, rather than the writing? Also keep in mind that these are stories meant for kids, and I've been treasuring this story as much as I did reading it when I was 5, for its visual splendor and historical references (yes, yes, I agree that in places, they coulda pulled it off better by *SHOWING* rather than just telling us, and having read your reviews, I agree it shoulda seen a few more revisions already in the design stage for that, but still...).<br /><br />I can also see how somebody having grown up especially on an American Scrooge will hate Martina's dickish and even assholish Scrooge. But you see, we continentals have grown up with him for decades and see nothing weird about him. There are some Barksist purists who think of the Italian comics as trash for that very thing, but they're a small minority among continental Donaldists.TlatoSMDnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post-71680136187757326372014-02-01T22:26:04.111-05:002014-02-01T22:26:04.111-05:00I'm so, so terribly sorry Geox! To make a long...I'm so, so terribly sorry Geox! To make a long story short, by the time I disappeared from your sight I had been procrastinating about a tiny change you'd demanded in chapter I for two or three weeks, when I was suddenly getting evicted from my place on short notice, which eventually ended up with all my stuff being dispersed over lotsa places, including my computer and all my hard drives, and with me tied up in lotsa legalese red tape to find a new place and get settled in.<br /><br />And by the time the dust settled after a few months and I'd gotten access to my stuff back, I was feeling so ashamed for having let you down on this that it's taken me until this very night to even just have another look at your invaluable blog (all this time fearing I'd find you being mighty pissed off at me, and reading your reviews of each chapter before I read your introduction here, it felt at first like you were panning the story exactly because of that) because I've been googling for Carpi scans to show them to somebody who's never heard of him.<br /><br />Now, having read your reviews of the individual chapters in the story, I see you mightily dislike the script by Martina, and you or somebody else has speculated the reason for its high INDUCKS rating would only be because of many Italian members and because of the story being about how great Italy is and so on.<br /><br />Don't you remember I told you even before we started our project that I've always cared more for the visual aspect of Disney stories, rather than the writing? Also keep in mind that these are stories meant for kids, and I've been treasuring this story as much as I did reading it when I was 5, for its visual splendor and historical references (yes, yes, I agree that in places, they coulda pulled it off better by *SHOWING* rather than just telling us, and having read your reviews, I agree it shoulda seen a few more revisions already in the design stage for that, but still...).<br /><br />I can also see how somebody having grown up especially on an American Scrooge will hate Martina's dickish and even assholish Scrooge. But you see, we continentals have grown up with him for decades and see nothing weird about him. There are some Barksist purists who think of the Italian comics as trash for that very thing, but they're a small minority among continental Donaldists.TlatoSMDnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post-37847444031719895952012-10-06T17:45:59.170-04:002012-10-06T17:45:59.170-04:00Thanks, and thanks for your hypothetical offer of ...Thanks, and thanks for your hypothetical offer of help--I was actually thinking of putting a request out there, but the ego-maniac in me was all like "no! grrr! must do entire thing by self!" Hope you like the series, or at any rate find it interesting.GeoX, one of the GeoX boys.https://www.blogger.com/profile/14658452994152399308noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5423579092779163824.post-65627477082133222652012-10-06T15:08:18.930-04:002012-10-06T15:08:18.930-04:00Wow, this is both fascinating and great - and the ...Wow, this is both fascinating and great - and the so-called "self-indulgent" bits about how this all came to pass were, for me, as interesting as the story may prove to be (haven't continued yet). I was about to offer to be a source for semi-fluent German translations when I read your passage regarding the proficiency of the online translations, which do appear to be improving with time. I commend your efforts, hoping that this does not run afoul of a certain large entertainment company who does not seem to care one whit whether fans in one part of the globe get to experience product not sold/offered in another if monetary advantage of a certain level is not achievable.<br /><br />Take care and I shall be reading on!Chuck Munsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02815223305362131302noreply@blogger.com